Newly Developed Police Tactics to Counter Direct Action at Mass Demonstrations

Tuesday, May 13 2003 @ 04:29 PM CDT

Contributed by: Admin

Submitted by Anti A. Gent:

Newly Developed Police Tactics to Counter Direct Action at Mass Demonstrations

by Anti A. Gent

Vancouver, Canada, Coast Salish Territories

May 12, 2003

In the February 2003 issue of “The Police Chief”, the official publication of the International Association of Chiefs of Police, Incorporated, an article entitled “Velvet Gloves and Iron Fists, Taking the Violence out of Major International Protests” described new strategies and tactics developed and implemented by Canadian police and security agencies to counter what they see as the growing use of direct action on the part of anti-globalization and anti-capitalist demonstrators at major protests against international institutions.

The article, written by Scott Allen, Sergeant in the National Security Investigative Service (NSIS) of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP), describes how police and security agencies have mobilized to counter “violence” at major protests. Allen says that this has become a major concern for law enforcement and security due to the escalating level of violence at protests, beginning with those against the World Trade Organization in Seattle in 1999, and continuing with demonstrations in Quebec City, Genoa and Ottawa.

Allen claims that the violence in Genoa resulted in one fatality. In Allen’s world, it wasn’t the police officer shooting Carlo Giuliani in the head that caused his death, but instead a more abstract and general climate of “violence”, which was initiated by the protestors.

Allen goes on to describe planning operations for the Group of 8 (G8) summit that occurred in Kananaskis June, 2002. Allen says that that law enforcement experts began planning to minimize and prevent direct action and sabotage as early as June 2001. Organizers of the G8 summit put their plans into action by changing the location from Ottawa to the remote and isolated Kananaskis resort, which only has one access road and is surrounded by mountains and forest. In the months leading up to the summit Canadian military officials publicly announced their massive presence in the area and stated that they would not be able to distinguish between protestors and terrorists in the woods and may shoot to kill. Allen says that because of these actions protestors who favoured “direct action” and “diversity of tactics” decided to go demonstrate in Ottawa instead, and large labour groups headed for Calgary to avoid the potential violence in Ottawa. The “Take The Capital” group which organized the Ottawa protest had the support of “organizations with known violent tendencies” according to the RCMP, and intensive preparations began which also involved the Ottawa Police Service, Ontario Provincial Police, Quebec Provincial Police, Gatineau Police, Canadian Security Intelligence Service (CSIS), Canadian Citizenship and Immigration and the Canadian Customs and Revenue Agency. The Ottawa fire department and paramedics were involved in planning as well.

Allen identifies several key factors, strategies and tactics that he claims were successful in limiting the amount of direct action at the Ottawa G8 protests and may be reused at future events.

The first key factor was information sharing between international agencies, particularly United States agencies. Cooperation at the Canadian, U.S. border was coordinated and worked well says Allen. Agencies in Europe were contacted to track any known European protestors “who might try to destabilize meetings through violence.” A special Joint Intelligence Group (JIG) was formed four months prior to the Take The Capital protest and was made up of members from many different police and security agencies. The JIG used large commercial databases such as Dialog and Newscan to collect historical and current information on persons, tactics and protestor planning. The Foreign Broadcast Information Service (FBIS) was used for international intelligence. The information gathered by the JIG allowed police and security to target key meetings and persons. The JIG identified all protestor busses before they left for Ottawa and tracked them en route. All protestors with violent criminal records were identified ahead of time and a book of photos and information on targeted persons was provided to street-level personnel. Protest “leaders” were identified and tracked, especially those with “policies of violence” or violent records. Cars and vans carrying persons in violation of parole or arrest conditions were tracked. Plain clothes police attended the protest march in Ottawa, and transmitted real-time tactical data to a command centre. Surveillance footage from video cameras mounted on buildings as well as an RCMP helicopter and Ottawa Police Service fixed-wing aircraft was sent to the command centre to track protestors and buses.

The second important factor was the decision to use the controversial “soft hat” approach. No special barriers were erected and protestors were not blocked from using parks. Tactical and riot police squads were kept close to the action but out of sight from demonstrators. Allen says the idea was to remove the typical elements of police mobilization which are seen as being “provocative” to protestors. At the same time police opted to use intimidation tactics in an effort to deter protesters from using direct action methods. Police announced the opening of a large temporary holding facility for use during possible mass arrests. Allen claims that protest leaders were intimidated and “leadership” evaporated during the march. He says that the intelligence gathered by the JIG was a key factor in implementing intimidation tactics which limited the amount of violence in Ottawa.

Ottawa police and RCMP also formed a Major Events Liaison Team (MELT) for Take The Capital and held public meetings with protest groups and concerned citizens. The MELT attempted to contact all known protest groups and was required to monitor all arriving buses. MELT members used intelligence gathered by the JIG to meet the busses, dressed in civilian clothes with a “police liaison” marking, and openly photograph all persons getting off. Allen describes the MELT group as an example of integrated policing.

The last tactic that was used by police and security agencies at the Ottawa protest is known as “saturation.” The Take The Capital protest march was saturated with uniformed and plain-clothes police officers. Uniformed police also lined the march route and openly displayed surveillance equipment. Protestors wearing masks were identified and observed carrying weapons and projectiles and Allen says that police sources could smell gasoline on protestors at certain points of the march. Some demonstrators who attempted to break away from the main march were followed and prevented from carrying out planned acts of sabotage against corporate property.

Allen illustrates these new tactical approaches in point form.

Isolation. Isolate the target of the protest to simplify security measures.

Intelligence gathering and sharing. Form a Joint Intelligence Group.

Soft Hat approach. No barriers. Keep riot police out of sight.

Saturation. Large and visible deployment of officers and surveillance equipment.

Integrated and Community Policing. Form a Major Events Liaison Team.

Allen’s article also demonstrates several important points to be considered by the international anti-capitalist movement.

Governments, security agencies and police increasingly view direct action and disruptive protest as an effective social force which necessitates complex coordination among agencies and the use of massive resources. This clearly indicates that small acts of sabotage, the attacks on corporate property which occur regularly at international protests, are not seen as “pointless” or “insignificant” by those in power, despite the claims to the contrary made by many social activists. Police and other authorities are well aware of the possibility for the use of sabotage to spread across social movements, and this is seen as a primary concern over the actual amount of monetary damage that specific acts of sabotage cause. Governments are willing to expend resources in an attempt to control and suppress active resistance , the will to rebel against the capitalist system, and the potential for a confrontational attitude to spread socially. Those in power are not unaware of the dynamics that occur berween militant anti-capitalists and the larger mass of people who attend large-scale protests. The context of mass demonstrations allows for direct action to take place within a mass setting, when otherwise groups of rebels could be easily isolated and arrested. The capitalists are likely very disturbed by the growing support for direct action at large demonstrations, and particularly the instances, such as in Seattle, Quebec City and Genoa, where local residents directly assisted anti-capitalist militants and often joined in the street battles against occupying police forces.

Despite their efforts, the authorities are still unable to prevent direct action, as was seen at the G8 protest in Ottawa as militants attacked a police vehicle and several corporate targets, and at many protests internationally since then. The capitalist project of total social control is impossible for them to complete, and becomes more difficult as more people directly oppose it.

In the context of international summits, governments find direct action on the streets to be embarrassing and often acknowledge that rebellious street demonstrations overshadow and tarnish the image of international institutions. When the streets of cities hosting international summits erupt in open revolt, the ruling class has lost an opportunity at making propaganda for its system. By isolating themselves they reveal both the power of the direct action movement and their own weakness and vulnerability.

Allen also admits in his article that it is often the police who “provoke” militant direct action through their heavy-handed tactics and their physical obstruction of protestors in attempting to block them from reaching their objectives. Although social activists are quick to undermine and denounce any acts of sabotage against corporate property as being “provocative” or even the work of “police agent provocateurs”, it should be clear to any serious revolutionaries that it is the oppression of the ruling class and their servants that provokes a response in the form of direct action.

Revolutionary anti-capitalists must not allow police intimidation to diffuse rebellious social movements or police repression to become an excuse for not taking action. All the various acts of sabotage carried out every day by oppressed individuals and groups show that resistance is both possible and necessary.

Anti A. Gent

Vancouver, Canada, Coast Salish Territories

May 12, 2003

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Newly Developed Police Tactics to Counter Direct Action at Mass Demonstrations | 53 comments | Create New Account

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comment by mexican anarchist

Authored by: Renegade on Wednesday, May 09 2007 @ 02:14 AM CDT

Totally! this is a great idea! if i can get some cement, Macdonald's beware!
i live in a rural community, where, sadly, corporate business is taking over and pushing out small local business. the most obvious of this is the power the wal-mart holds over the area. it has shut down the small businesses who were competitors; and helped promote mcdonalds over franks po-boy shop. i try to spend very little time there. but i need for there to be better resistance, and an alternative, organic local mart for all the stuff that grows here.
plantains, mous poluse, potatoes, grapes, carrots, and the shrimp tralled locally.
the shrimp that is sold at walmart was grown in the sewers of china and then sailed and trucked thousands of miles. but it doesn't have to be, it is tralled locally, and those shrimp are better for you. shopping local markets would give back to the cajun community rather that contribute to the tyranny of wal-mart
i need suggestions on how to go about pulling customers away from devil-mart

---
~~~I know things~~~

comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, May 13 2003 @ 05:42 PM CDT

This is a fucking excellent analysis of what the polcie are doing. Very little of this information surprises me, because I\'ve been able to deduce it at local protests and by following accounts of other protests. The problem is that North American activists have gotten increasingly stupid about their use of tactics at protests and naive about strategy decisions. While I think the police give themselves too much credit, they have been increasingly effective against us activists and that is mostly OUR fault.

I\'m just mystified why we go along with activist plans to go back to the disempowering protests of the 80s and 90s. It\'s like we were having fun at Seattle, Prague, Genoa and Quebec City, and then promptly forgot what we were doing. On the other hand, I\'ve seen more people willing to stand up to the cops at recent protests here, so maybe we have been in a funk.

The decision by activists to not go after the G8 summit in Kananaskis was a big strategic blunder. We showed the cops and the state that we would buckle under if they came up with the right scheme that was too much of a challenge for us. It could be argued that our movement dropped the ball at Kananaskis and lost the momentum we were building after New York City and Washington. Some would argue that I have no right to criticize a protest that I didn\'t help organize, but I\'ll point out that I worked with folks to host an anti-capitalist protest in Washington after 9-11. You want to talk about politically difficult? Try and top that! Moving affinity groups through a forest would be a piece of cake compared to September 2001.

This report suggest several strategies for activists. One is that we need to get our shit together and be more intelligent about our tactics and methods. We also need to be more responsible activists, which means that we should be careful about what we say about other activists and keep the big picture in mind. Training and skills-sharing is important.

This analysis also demonstrates that the cops have been successful in splitting our ranks by preying on movement controversies like property destruction and violence. It\'s OK for us have our disagreements about this, but it\'s important that we marginalize and/or confront thos activists who publicly marginalize militants by suggesting that p-d and violence is the work of police provocateurs. Working people have engaged in these tactics throughout history. It\'s highly irresponsible (and insulting) when activists cop-bait militant activists.

We can\'t afford to let this information dampen our protest. We need to stand up to it, knowing that lots of people have our backs.

Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, May 13 2003 @ 05:49 PM CDT

Oops! Forgot to add that we need to conduct an ongoing war against the police everywhere they can be found. Let\'s change the rules of the engagement.

Stay illegible!

comment by Mike

Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, May 13 2003 @ 06:05 PM CDT

First of all, we need much better recon. We need locals to scout out the site, note danger locations (possible police staging areas, especially parking garages) and refuges.

Second, we need to take swarming seriously. We need much better communication between groups and more initiative by small groups when communications break down. Every team of 5-15 people should include at least one person who has already scouted the area and is familiar with it; this means the locals act not as a contingent but as a group of specialists.

Third, we need retriaval teams. When people are in danger, we need other groups capable of either interrupting pursuit or creating an un-arrest situation. Even in a simple blockade, I figure 1/3 of the people should be involved in either retrieval teams or other support/reseerve teams.

Fourth, we need to take logistics seriously. We need to prepare for people who have odd schedules and will be arriving a few days early or staying a few days late.

Fifth, we need to hit them where they ain\'t. If the security in one city is too tight, we should shut another one down...

comment by Deicide

Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, May 13 2003 @ 06:44 PM CDT

Strike in the night. Disappear into the anonymity of cover. Direct action in the parameters of what the state controls is running obsolete.

comment by @nonymous

Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, May 13 2003 @ 07:32 PM CDT

If this aticle is taken from a website, could you give the link???

comment by RS@

Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, May 13 2003 @ 09:27 PM CDT

Excellent ideas that\'ve come to my mind over the past couple years (Esp. #s 1 and 3; recon and retrieval has been awful at each major protest I\'ve been to).

Perhaps these ideas should be introduced as a new topic?

comment by strategy vs. tactics

Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, May 13 2003 @ 10:58 PM CDT

By Any Means Necessary is not a rhetoric that anarchists should be adopting as this is the logic of Stalin, Hitler, Lenin, Mao, Bush; I am getting sick of this rhetoric that says that any critique of political violence is necessarily playing into the hands of the state - it IS a fact that the police have used political violence as an excuse to clamp down on popular movements. Look at the effect the Red Brigades and the now-acknowledged \"Strategy of Tension\" had on the popular Autonomia movement. They were all declared terrorists and seen by many as being in bed with the Stalinists of the Red Brigades even though they totally hated each other. Likewise, the Black Bloc HAS been infiltrated in the past and this should not be denied but instead it should be learned from in order to move beyond the weaknesses our strategies have shown in the past. We need a diversity of tactics but we also need a strategy of tactics so that they are used appropriately when it makes sense. In other words it is an unstrategic use of tactics to break windows at an intersection where pacifists are locked down in an act of civil disobedience; it is a strategic use of tactics to break windows in a \"red zone\" such as existed in Quebec City where it would not markedly affect activists who choose different tactics. If we are working towards a world in which hierarchy and authority are dismantled and diversity and horizontality are the watchwords of the day then our means need to be in line with our ends, this is an anarchist standby for over two centuries now.

comment by strategy through tactics

Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, May 13 2003 @ 11:14 PM CDT

I agree that violent escalation is not a good idea.

But, whatever we do, we need much better tactics. If we have skilled, trained, confident retrieval teams, familiar with the terrain they move in, it should work wonders.

Now these things are important to any team in any action, but they are especially important to retrieval teams; these are people resisting violence without violence, and protecting others from violence. They have to know how to avoid getting trapped themselves, and how to extricate others from police traps.

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 12:45 AM CDT

we should move beyond the black bloc and do something more creative- like clogging toilets with quick dry cement- a buissness cannot run without bathrooms its illegal in the usa. so dress normal and leave your punk rags at home get a coffee cup out of the trash act like your taking a shit pour cement in (bring it in a yuppie bag) sit on toilete for a few minutes then walk out bring a few friends both male and female to clog both restrooms if you do this every week you can cost commpanies way more money than broken windows not to mention pissing the yuppies off enough so that they no longer go to that store.Theres so much more we can do to hurt corporations just be creative- and in the long run if your balck bloc is beaten by the cops and we dont get to smash shit you can always go to starbucks mcdonalds gap and clog their toilets and go home with a smile on -ahhh i made a difference!!

comment by Franz Kafka

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 12:46 AM CDT

\"In the context of international summits, governments find direct action on the streets to be embarrassing and often acknowledge that rebellious street demonstrations overshadow and tarnish the image of international institutions.\"

I thought this was a great point. It\'s important to remember that the powerful imagery of militant protests can not only overwhelm the message of \'peaceful\' traditional protests, but also the message of the institutions themselves.

Breaking windows is great street theater because it is designed to be absorbed into the media spectacle, and can\'t really be co-opted because everyone pissed off with capitalism understands that broken windows are a sign for rage against the system - kind of like using the media to send our own coded messages.

One of the most impressive aspects of the Seattle protests was when 100-plus local residents joined in the looting - they could see through the media\'s words because the images of broken windows and screaming anarchists can\'t be completely erased and re-written on the 5 o\'clock news, unlike sign waving, which can easily be seen as a polite and civil diversion, nothing urgent.

Anyway, I think it\'s naive to think that these summits themselves are much more than PR events for the leaders. Any way to make their propaganda events ours is a victory.

comment by unabomber

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 03:33 AM CDT

I am not sure if clugging toilets is a good alternative to black bloc but I do feel that the black bloc tactic stopped working in Seattle. Even though the black bloc may be out of date in some areas it can still be used in Anti-Fascist actions and demos. Some people say that the black bloc keeps our riots only within the black bloc and leave people out that might want to riot since they feel that they do not have the right clothing on. Also the level of police harassement we get just for showing up they have successfully suceeded in crimminalizing yet another black(again). anyway, coming up with alternatives or other functions for such a bloc is for you and others to decide.
If the powers that by want to put these international summits i some far off place like remote kanada, fuck em, we will then met in Toronto, NYC, or something. We shouldnt be so depended on them to always pick the place for us 100,000 people to met, even though sometimes it nice to confront them where they are(if it works.) blah...

comment by Circuit

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 06:31 AM CDT

Although that has it\'s place, within the context of a mass movement, it\'s ultimately too defeatist and vanguardist (ie, \"the masses will never rise up, so let\'s just do it for them.\")

Night actions only work within the context of a broader movement. It is only one tactic amongst many, and although it\'s a powerful tactic, it\'s ridiculous to use it solely to define the whole of the movement against capital.

Circuit

comment by

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 07:55 AM CDT

Does anyone have the original source(s) for this article. When the author starts making comments about more confrontational and symbolic actions being more useful and feared by the police, s/he doesn\'t quote anything.

I can see that being true, but perhaps due to my own bias for such actions. Peaceful protests are a dime a dozen and the only way to separate one from many is size. Nothing about them leaves the least bit of a lasting impression in anyone\'s mind, even if they have really large numbers.

I\'d say even right now, Quebec, Seattle, and Genoa still resonate much greater in people\'s minds than the 500,000 people in NYC and the millions all over the world and that was just a few months ago, but it already feels as if it never happened.

I don\'t think that means we should just jump back into the old ways exactly as we remember them. We have attempted that and failed.

Calling for a black bloc and telling people to prepare just doesn\'t work (anymore?).

More effort needs to be put into creating an atmosphere for such desires to be awaken.

Outsiders must be kept informed of what is going on and how the local city operates. No matter what 5-15 people intend to try to do, when they come to a city they are unfamaliar with surrounded by law enforcement everywhere, the desire to do anything the least bit risky is probably going to disappear.

The focus on the usual tactics should be abandoned. They are cliche, everyone expects them. If the oppurtunities arise, people should be prepared to take advantage, but focusing on damagaing local MNC chains when we know they are going to be protected by police takes away from more useful strategies we could be taking part in.

And the black bloc is just a simple tactic, not the one-true-revolutionary-force that is going to save us all. We should not cling so hard to a single tactical choice, it\'s weird and counter-productive. It\'s not something we are born with and have no choice in sticking to it, it\'s one simple tactical choice. There was a time that there was no such thing as a \"black bloc,\" were we not able to do anything then? If we stick with the black bloc, we are going to see continued failures because there is no easier way for cops to spot any potential troublemakers and head them off before they occur. That\'s how it has been for over a year now.

Things are a lot different in Greece and Germany or whatever, we have to deal with the problems we are facing, not pretending we live in situations we don\'t.

And of course respect for all protesters must be maintained...it was in Quebec, Prague and Genoa, etc.

comment by Kurt Morris

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 10:11 AM CDT

I have been studying ninjutsu for 5 years now. and would be more than happy to perform recon (or other missions) for any anarchist group that has a need for such a thing. If there are any questions my email is limppunk@lycos.com

comment by pr waxing nostalgic.

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 08:54 AM CDT

Somewhere between breaking windows,clogging toilets and a black \'red brigade\',(that NO ONE ever suggests and with good reason.)there exists KaGaA*
(The Killer application for Governmental accountabilty through Anarchism.)
Kill the president.my 2c.

Public Subscription Assassination
\"If we find negligence on the side of any person or institution...
http://www.halfbakery.com/idea/Public_20Subscription_20Assassination
... Public Subscription Assassination .Assassins sans Frontiers.

Bring back propaganda of the deed.

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 09:50 AM CDT

Are you an anarchist or just some liberal? It\'s pretty evident that you haven\'t spent any time thinking about what anarchists do and you are merely lashing out at something you don\'t like.

Fact is that black blocs have been an extremely successful tactic and anarchists have been very judicious about using the tactic. Of course, we should be using a full range of tactics, but then all anarchists are using a broad range of tactics to achieve our goals.

Doesn\'t the mystified \"black bloc\" only show how far corrupted the \"anarchist\" movement is?

So you are saying that a tactic of solidarity, mutual aid, and militancy is a sign that the anarchist movement has become \"corrupted.\" Since when is practicing our ideas a corruption of those ideas? Since you aren\'t an anarchist, perhaps you don\'t know about the fact that people who do the black bloc are also involved in many different forms of activim, ranging from community organizing to workplace organizing to work on all varieties of special campaigns and projects.

It is not anymore important to think and prepare for \"revolution\", no, it is enough to make some kind of vandalism-party out of every major protest; smashing the windows of McDonalds can hardly be named \"direct action\" nor \"sabotage\" (!) as the author tries to make us believe.

You sound like the type that sits around in the armchair, trying to figure out how to make revolution happen without getting out there and trying some stuff out. Your ignorance about the black bloc shows through in these sentences, because most black blocs haven\'t even involved a spectacle of property destruction. And the black blocs that have been involved in direct action and p-d have accomplished some important things. We all know about the lasting impact that the Seattle BB has had on anarchism, activism, and capitalism. This might not sit well with your worldview, but the vandalism of capitalist properties is something that capitalists don\'t want the public to see. This image of disgruntled people who are unhappy with capitalism, doesn\'t play well with those who seek to keep Americans branwashed about the capitalist Utopia they supposedly live in. And the series of property destruction aimed at certain corporations, such as McDonalds, have had a serious negative impact on their bottom line.

One thing is for sure: Capitalism can\'t be destroyed by some deplorable, disguised figures smashing windows. The fetishism of the \"black bloc\" shows, that the \"anarchist movement\" (hard to say whether it exists at all, outside some self-celebrating websites) is in a tactical dead end

Your wishful thinking is not going to make anarchism go away. Which political tendency are you with, which prompts you to make these wild attacks on anarchism? The anarchist movement is still growing rapidly--I can refer you to your local anarchist or anarchist group if you contact me.

instead of planning and preparing new, powerful attacks on the structures of power, finding a new revolutionary doctrine, we end up turning in circles: how much revolutionary energy is wasted

It seems to me like the anarchist and anti-capitalist movements have acomplished more in the past 4 years in the US than what the Left here has been talking about for 50 years. Why do we need a new revolutionary doctrine? Can we buy this at the food co-op? There is still plenty of revolutionary energy out there--there\'s no reason to worry about it being \"wasted.\"

Actually, I think the police and the State only welcome every effort by \"anarchists\" to prepare for some \"trouble\" at major protests - because this keeps them busy and away from what was once their real goal: revolution, the complete negation and overthrow of all powers that exist.

Sorry, but if the state and the authorities wanted us to continue this stuff, they wouldn\'t be spending so much money trying to stop it, subvert it, and oppress it. Why are the cops so careful about praising \"good\" protesters and demonizing \"bad\" ones? Because they know that they can depend on good protesters to police themselves and organize protests that can be ignored. The state, the capitalists, and the authorities fear protests that can\'t be controlled and that target their authority and control.

we need to come together, start organizing real action that has the potential to overthrow the machine.

Nice phrase, but many of us are already doing that.

comment by Anti-Black-Bloc Fetishism

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 09:10 AM CDT

\"Breaking windows is great street theater because it is designed to be absorbed into the media spectacle\"

There we go. Doesn\'t the mystified \"black bloc\" only show how far corrupted the \"anarchist\" movement is? It is not anymore important to think and prepare for \"revolution\", no, it is enough to make some kind of vandalism-party out of every major protest; smashing the windows of McDonalds can hardly be named \"direct action\" nor \"sabotage\" (!) as the author tries to make us believe. And of course - the media cover is the true goal of all of this. How far did we sink? Finally, we accept the rules and logic of the Spectacle (I\'m referring to Debord here) - rules made by those in power, under which we cannot win.

One thing is for sure: Capitalism can\'t be destroyed by some deplorable, disguised figures smashing windows. The fetishism of the \"black bloc\" shows, that the \"anarchist movement\" (hard to say whether it exists at all, outside some self-celebrating websites) is in a tactical dead end: instead of planning and preparing new, powerful attacks on the structures of power, finding a new revolutionary doctrine, we end up turning in circles: how much revolutionary energy is wasted - and the other commentators plan to waste even more - for preparing to turn some demonstration into a pitiful \"riot\"? If anybody seriously believes, that this is any real threat to the capitalist world order - I would really like to hear some arguments why. It is - and it has always been - just a matter of police tactics to end all of those \"riots\" - and the \"rioters\" drive home again and chat online about their heroic deeds.

Actually, I think the police and the State only welcome every effort by \"anarchists\" to prepare for some \"trouble\" at major protests - because this keeps them busy and away from what was once their real goal: revolution, the complete negation and overthrow of all powers that exist.

Don\'t fool yourself: I don\'t have the solution; but the more effort we put in these indirect means of \"struggle\", the more we depend on the machine; and give up revolution itself. Instead, we need to come together, start organizing real action that has the potential to overthrow the machine.

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comment by dogboy

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 10:34 AM CDT

its funney we must orginise and become more millitet in our set up to out army the armey
Rece
retrevel squades
strong forse weak forse
dame it all and lets bild a armey aredey
or do what was done in San fran last month and go comando in small grups
sereusley they are all good ideas and sutch but yes wev out growin the black block
we need a new tactick
RTS, protest march, and stuff are all cool but wont wint the Harts and mineds that we need

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comment by

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 10:37 AM CDT

i like the way you write dogboy

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comment by Deicide

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 11:08 AM CDT

\"By Any Means Necessary\" was an essay written by Malcolm X arguing the point that with regards to human rights, they ought to be protected by any means necessary. \"We declare our right on this earth...to be a human being, to be respected as a human being, to be given the rights of a human being in this society, on this earth, in this day which we intend to bring into existence by any means necessary,\" he said. In the context of revolutionary movements, the tactical principle of \"by any means necessary\" has always meant this. Self-defense by any means necessary. Self-determination by any means necessary. Human rights by any means necessary. If your talking about Hitler or Stalin, then your talking about tyranny by any means necessary...but your also talking about a completely different point. Be careful, because your making an inaccurate comparison. If Malcolm were alive, I\'m sure he\'d approvingly smile about the anarchist black bloc.

It is important to not let our knee-jerk associations dominate our reactions to concepts. I really think people need to sit down and hash out a refined and workable definition of \"non-violence\" before they begin to make arguments for or against it.

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comment by rise

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 11:55 AM CDT

heh, stay illegible indeed. Boy, that was a Fruedian slip if I\'ve ever heard one...

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comment by McAnarchy in the Playpen

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 11:57 AM CDT

this is too rich. This entire thread is waaay too rich.

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comment by

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 11:58 AM CDT

it almost sounds like how an actual dog/boy would talk

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comment by

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 11:58 AM CDT

like scooby doo or something

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comment by

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 01:16 PM CDT

Ha! anarchist tactics WORK!!! They are against the logic of the system! They are left helpless as to how to respond! HOW do you stop thousands decentralized autonomous bands of 5-15 people moving through a city to shut it down? The police in San Francisco couldn\'t figure that one out. IMAGINE IF OTHER PEOPLE HAD DONE THE SAME THING!!! oh, it would have been sweet.
That said FUCKING FACE IT the black bloc is completely, entirely obsolete (except in the context of anti-fascist protests, and maybe soem others) but if s27-28 didnt teach us that we will never learn. THe greatest thing about quebec city was that EVERYONE was rioting. The fucking locals put the black bloc to shame. I\'ve heard the same thing about Genoa. So lets fucking forget about it and move on (and continue to find other ways to organize and fight at demonstrations as anarchists). How about a color bloc?

ANd fucking Everyone should read Starhawk\'s essay that she wrote after the Calgary G8 protests it was the most important document in our movement at least of last summer, if not the last few years (I dont rememer what its called but the name had something to do about cooking a meal for the appropriate size of your guests) Calgary failed not because it wasnt militant enough but BECAUSE IT WASNT FLEXBLE ENOUGH so let\'s get up our arses, get creative, and figure out how to do something!!! Arghhhhh!!

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comment by McDick

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 01:23 PM CDT

\"Governments, security agencies and police increasingly view direct action and disruptive protest as an effective social force which necessitates complex coordination among agencies and the use of massive resources.\"

Effective social force? Too funny... guys, don\'t break your arm while you\'re patting yourself on the back.

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comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 01:45 PM CDT

Well, the new protest movements have been an effective social force, which is confirmed if you read the publications published by the ruling class. They are pretty damn concerned about the rise of the new social movements. This is hardly controversial, except for those who seek to denigrate activists and sow doubts within our ranks.

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comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 01:47 PM CDT

It\'s rich because we have had many successes of late, which have forced the authorities to find new ways to deal with us.

I have been an activist for over 15 years. I don\'t ever remember reading about the cops talking about activists in this way 10 years ago, or even 15 years ago.

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comment by lola

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 02:09 PM CDT

bottom line is that FTAA meeting in miami nov 2003 is the most important protest to take place in the united states since seattle. that said, the protests need to be historic. put it this way: miami should be locked in a \'state of emergency\' during the FTAA meetings.

so let\'s discuss how we can make miami nov 2003 not just a protest, but a REBELLION.

i mean, we\'ve had two years to re-evaluate our strategy/tactics. i think that we\'re due to break out.

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comment by chris

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 02:17 PM CDT

\"Are you an anarchist or just some liberal?\"

Do you have an argument, or does it simply consist of calling people names?

\"Fact is that black blocs have been an extremely successful tactic\"

Fact is that blanket assertions like this, which cannot be proved or disproved, might sound impressive, but aren\'t really convincing anyone of anything.

Is capitalism overthrown yet? No. Well, then, maybe the black bloc tactic hasn\'t been quite as successful as you\'d like, eh?

\"You sound like the type that sits around in the armchair, trying to figure out how to make revolution happen without getting out there and trying some stuff out.\"

Wow, more insults. How original. And the idea that if you think something is wrong, you should go and \"try it out\", and your mind will be changed. Well, I think blowing up buses is wrong. Should and I go and try it out, and then see if my mind is changed?

I also like the insinuation that anyone who disagrees with you or black bloc tactics is of course, wrong, and an idiot.

\"We all know about the lasting impact that the Seattle BB has had on anarchism, activism, and capitalism.\"

Yup! Remeber in 1999, when the entire system came crashing down? Oh wait, it didn\'t.

\"This might not sit well with your worldview, but the vandalism of capitalist properties is something that capitalists don\'t want the public to see.\"

Now here you\'re just going right off the deep end. Capitalists don\'t give a shit if the \"public\" sees you smashing shit; in fact, they use it to their advantage. If it bleeds, it leads. Why, exactly, do you think Seattle got so much attention in the world media? Because of your scathing post-left analysis of capitalism? Nope, guess again!! Because it was a big riot! The ONLY time that demonstrations get a lot of attention from the corporate media is when there is violence of some kind, be it property destruction or otherwise. Capitalists love pictures of black-clad anarchists smashing things, because to Joe Public you bear a startling resemblance to soccer hooligans.

So, first you brag about how great Seattle was. Then you turn around and say that capitalists try and hide the shit that made Seattle famous. Right-o.

\"This image of disgruntled people who are unhappy with capitalism, doesn\'t play well with those who seek to keep Americans branwashed about the capitalist Utopia they supposedly live in. And the series of property destruction aimed at certain corporations, such as McDonalds, have had a serious negative impact on their bottom line.\"

1) See above

2) McDonalds, like any other corporation, has any number of factors that affect it\'s profits. I know that in your own inflated sense of self-importance, you caused McDonalds to lose money, but reality disagrees. And even if that is the case, so what? People will just go to other fast food restaurants. I don\'t see Taco Bell, Burger King, or Wendy\'s going under either.

\"Your wishful thinking is not going to make anarchism go away.\"

So, stating your opinion that smashing windows will not destroy capitalism is \"wishful thinking\". I\'m glad to know that any opinion or argument that doesn\'t agree with what the Revered has to say is \"wishful thinking.\"

\"Which political tendency are you with, which prompts you to make these wild attacks on anarchism?\"

Again, with the ad homenim attacks that have nothing to do with the substance of the argument. Does it make a difference what \"political tendency\" this person is? Are only capital A Anarchists (TM) qualified to discuess these issues? Perhaps I should refrain from criticizing the sexist and racist behaviour of religious fundamentalists as well; I\'m not part of that group, therefore I\'m not entitled to impose my \"wishful thinking\" on them, being a sinner and all.

\"The anarchist movement is still growing rapidly--I can refer you to your local anarchist or anarchist group if you contact me.\"

So what? The National Front is growing rapidly in France - they got 18% in the last election. Does that them good, or noble, or validate what they do? No.

\"It seems to me like the anarchist and anti-capitalist movements have acomplished more in the past 4 years in the US than what the Left here has been talking about for 50 years.\"

It seems like that to you, because as we can see from your comments, anyone who disagrees with you is simply dismissed as an idiot. The US is growing further and further to the right, and I don\'t see that stopping anytime in the very near future. There is a certainly a growing progressive movement; there is also a massive part of the population that isn\'t the slightest bit interested in what you have to say.

\"The state, the capitalists, and the authorities fear protests that can\'t be controlled and that target their authority and control.\"

It is the police\'s job to, when they know people are going to do things that are illegal, or are highly likely to, stop them. If they sat around and let activists trash cities, people would be furious.

Additionally, you\'re not really targeting anyone\'s \"authority\" or \"control\". That\'s based on the consent of the general public. You\'ll dismiss me as an idiot liberal, of course, but from where I sit all of the riots in the world are not going to challenge the general public\'s tacit acceptance of private property and law and order. Society runs a certain way because people want it that way or don\'t care enough to change it. Riots don\'t do anything to change that.

Two days ago in Toronto, a little girl disappeared; they found parts of her body yesterday floating in Lake Ontario. In this kind of world, do you see the vast majority baying for the abolition of the police? I don\'t.

\"Nice phrase, but many of us are already doing that.\"

Nice smugness, but an argument make, it does not.

chris

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comment by @

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 03:16 PM CDT

\"The US is growing further and further to the right, and I don\'t see that stopping anytime in the very near future\"

Chris, this has nothing to do with wether or not anarchism is growing as a movement. And I don\'t necessarily think that just because the government is moving to the right that the populaition is. If you remember, 2 years ago more people voted for gore and nader than did for bush. What do all the nonvoters think? Neither you or I know. I don\'t think it\'s very disputable that anarchism has caught on, it\'s at least a lot more visible.

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comment by

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 03:32 PM CDT

The problem is, we really don\'t got shit to put our faith in at the moment. All of the traditional stuff has had it\'s day and is in decline for various reasons and they don\'t look like a threat to anything anymore.

But the only \"new\" thing we got going on is a more self-focused style anarchism and a different approach to protests.

I think that is a whole can of worms in itself that should be taken seriously.

But that aside, it seems some of those stuck with the black bloc tactic have no intention of ever breaking with it.

I think there are a lot of people in between who are no longer interested in doing the black bloc but do want to do something other than marching about at protests.

The pros of a black bloc are not limited to the black bloc. Any group of people who come together with a cooperative spirit are capable of helping each other out. Dressing in black is not the only way to make that happen, nor is it guaranteed. Dressing in black does not give a person new protesting abilities. Dressing in black is also not the only way to become anonymous, nor is it be the best anymore. You\'re more anonymous wearing everyday clothes than wearing all black....who is going to be interested in following people around in regular pants and a tshirt? People dressed average are all over the city. If you were a cop, who would stick out more to you?

And wasn\'t our goal the general disruption of these meetings before (except with anti-war protests)? Let\'s think about the best ways of doing that, rather than just the best ways to (re)create a riot.

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comment by The Average Block

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 04:08 PM CDT

Yes, why not an \"average\" block in which peole do their best to look as typical and as normal as possible - what does the typical Miamian look like in terms of dress and hairstyle? Do they often wear sunglasses? Lets try to think a little creatively here and maybe we can accomplish even more than the Black Bloc ever did! This doesnt mean no window-breaking it means refusing to fall into a predictable holding pattern that the security forces can strategize against. Why not do an indepth analysis of radical strategy and tactics from Seattle to the recent San Francisco and Portland uprisings and assess what has worked and what has not?

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comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 04:20 PM CDT

There\'s nothing Freudian about suggesting people stay illegible to the state. This is a very important practice for activists, especially those who face, or experience, state repression. This is why we wear black masks at demos, but illegibility to the state is more than just stuff we do on the street.

States have historically spent large sums of money and devoted many resources to understanding and classifying every aspect of the subjects that they rule. We\'re talking here about the census, licenses, databases, registries, and so on. Wasn\'t it Proudhon who has that great quote about \"I will not be index, filed, etc.\"? This is what I\'m talking about when I suggest that people become more \"illegible.\"

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comment by Anti-Black-Bloc is back!

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 05:13 PM CDT

1. Thanks to Chris. Good points, good points.

2. Oh, again: this thread is growing older and older and older. It seems to me always the same with this comments-forum: whenever you start developing some discussion, some points, the whole thing moves on, outdates it, and finally everything that is real is submerged by the constant wave of newer news and more stories. It\'s critical, but I don\'t know what to do against it.

However, I take the pleasure to defend the point again (even if nobody\'s ever going to read it).
3. Chuck0: \"Sorry, but if the state and the authorities wanted us to continue this stuff, they wouldn\'t be spending so much money trying to stop it, subvert it, and oppress it.\"

Wait - wasn\'t my thesis that in fact, by giving you the illusion that you achieved something, the capitalist/cop makes sure you keep going on smashing windows while big bosses are making untold profits three doors away?

4. A self-proclaimed anarchist accused me of \"not being anarchist\". Well, as Chris pointed out, does that mean my point doesn\'t count at all? How can I become an anarchist, like you? Do I need to read books? Do I have to adopt your holy opinion - Anarchism (TM)? Shouldn\'t we rather think that Anarchism means thinking, whatever you want (oh, you\'ll tear me apart for having said that; but that\'s the most direct way to say it). Or what else is your \"diversity of tactics\"? If I can\'t criticize you and your \"tactic\" - well, then your \"tactic\" (as well as you) become a purely bourgeois apology - hypocracy (TM).

5. The ultimate goal - to bring Capitalism down (and replace it with - whatever), is the imminent goal of every revolutionary movement; only by it can it be judged. And? Today, 155 years after the Communist Manifesto (I\'d like to date the consciousfight against capitalism from that point), capitalism is stronger than ever. To deny this, is a pure lie. No riot, no revolution (from the Commune to Spain to Lenin) could prevent this; the only things that were achieved were made good by some liberal reforms, wishing away the dropped blood and making compromises. Of course, we always have the indirect pressure a revoultionary movement poses (by helping those compromisers, who suddenly are on the \"good\" side); we can choose to give up revolution or to \"try again\", so to speak. But we should be called hypocrites if we talk about revolution but in reality have given it up long ago.

6. Of course, my buzz-\"new revolutionary doctrine\" can\'t be bought anywhere; but if our actions are not successful, we need to seriously examine them and re-evaluate our tactics - and develop new ones.

7. I don\'t deny that Seattle might have marked a break with history until that point - but a weak one. If we stop at Seattle, we will be corrupted and turn in circles. Capitalism moves on, all the time. Seattle gave us the one-second-advantage that might have been necessary - but now it is time to put it into reality, into actions - we have, so to speak, kept the dominions busy for a time, but if we don\'t speed up now, they will pass us (again). Positively. (Sorry for all those fucking words. Lost my own thread, so I had to disguise it a bit until I again found a piece of it.)

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comment by Anti-Bloc

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 05:22 PM CDT

Well, the new protest movements have been an effective social force, which is confirmed if you read the publications published by the ruling class. They are pretty damn concerned about the rise of the new social movements. This is hardly controversial, except for those who seek to denigrate activists and sow doubts within our ranks.

1. ...\"are concerned\"...: well, they have nothing else to worry. That is something we should be concerned about.

2. ...\"sow doubts within our ranks\"...: I hope you don\'t really mean this the way it is stated; so I save you from the usual all-around accusation and calling you names and just suppose you understand the irrationality of this statement and silently take it back. (Or is there suddenly an anarchist movement that can\'t stand to be criticized? That has to maintain a strict, totalitarian (fascist?) line of opinion? And I thought the Fuhrer was dead.)

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comment by NOYMFB

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 08:42 PM CDT

For those in the Mid-Atlantic area:

Let\'s start organizing locally for the FTAA and take a huge Mid-Atlantic Anarchist contigent down to Miami in November. If we want something to happen in Miami it is going to take more than just posting on Infoshop. There is a new anti-capitalist group trying to form up in DC. Maybe we could pick the first Sunday of June to meet at the new DC Infoshop space to start planning?

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comment by mick

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 07:06 PM CDT

is most of this thread an elaborate parody or does infoshop only attract people with little grip on reality?

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comment by

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 08:06 PM CDT

Most people here have a grip on reality; the ones without a grip are just posting a lot more.

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comment by

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 08:07 PM CDT

I\'m a nonvoter. I think all the politicians and capitalists should be hung.

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comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 08:11 PM CDT

You means the ones that spend their time cutting down all of the people who have accomplished so much lately? They seem to be out thick today.

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comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 08:35 PM CDT

Before we continue, could anti-black bloc explain to us who they are and what kind of activism they are involved with? I\'d like to know if you are a cop or just some kind of orthodox fake anarchist.

1. Thanks to Chris. Good points, good points.

If you like people who make ignorant anti-anarchist points...

2. Oh, again: this thread is growing older and older and older. It seems to me always the same with this comments-forum: whenever you start developing some discussion, some points, the whole thing moves on, outdates it, and finally everything that is real is submerged by the constant wave of newer news and more stories. It\'s critical, but I don\'t know what to do against it.

This is a news site, not a discussion site. If you want to talk at length about some issue, please start a thread at Infoshop Forums.

BTW, let me point out that the interesting discussion in activist circles is happening here on Infoshop News, instead of on Indymedia websites like several years ago. Some of you don\'t like our moderation policies, but you wouldn\'t have good discussions here without them.

However, I take the pleasure to defend the point again (even if nobody\'s ever going to read it). 3. Chuck0: \"Sorry, but if the state and the authorities wanted us to continue this stuff, they wouldn\'t be spending so much money trying to stop it, subvert it, and oppress it.\"
Wait - wasn\'t my thesis that in fact, by giving you the illusion that you achieved something, the capitalist/cop makes sure you keep going on smashing windows while big bosses are making untold profits three doors away?

Your thesis is one that has been trotted out by liberal activists for many years. Or the pacifists make this argument. This argument usually argues that we are doing exactly what the police want. If that was the case, why don\'t they just stand around and watch?

See, only in the US, and in some European countries where the Left still has some power, will you hear these arguments against militant street actions.

4. A self-proclaimed anarchist accused me of \"not being anarchist\". Well, as Chris pointed out, does that mean my point doesn\'t count at all? How can I become an anarchist, like you? Do I need to read books? Do I have to adopt your holy opinion - Anarchism (TM)? Shouldn\'t we rather think that Anarchism means thinking, whatever you want (oh, you\'ll tear me apart for having said that; but that\'s the most direct way to say it). Or what else is your \"diversity of tactics\"? If I can\'t criticize you and your \"tactic\" - well, then your \"tactic\" (as well as you) become a purely bourgeois apology - hypocracy (TM).

Hey, I\'m just going to ridicule your liberal arguments. I\'ve been critical of the balck bloc too, but I\'ve haven\'t rejected it outright.

5. The ultimate goal - to bring Capitalism down (and replace it with - whatever), is the imminent goal of every revolutionary movement; only by it can it be judged. And? Today, 155 years after the Communist Manifesto (I\'d like to date the consciousfight against capitalism from that point), capitalism is stronger than ever.

Really? Did you lose any money in your retirement account? Do you read the financial press? Capitalism isn\'t doing so well these days. It didn\'t help when the anti-globalization movement started discrediting major capitalist institutions and started showing everybody that not all folks are happy with capitalism.

To deny this, is a pure lie. No riot, no revolution (from the Commune to Spain to Lenin) could prevent this; the only things that were achieved were made good by some liberal reforms, wishing away the dropped blood and making compromises. Of course, we always have the indirect pressure a revoultionary movement poses (by helping those compromisers, who suddenly are on the \"good\" side); we can choose to give up revolution or to \"try again\", so to speak. But we should be called hypocrites if we talk about revolution but in reality have given it up long ago.

I\'m more interested in making the revoluton happen, instead of talking about how it may or may not happen. I\'m pretty confident with how the anti-capitalist movements have been proceeding. If you don\'t like what they are doing, you are free to sit things out.

6. Of course, my buzz-\"new revolutionary doctrine\" can\'t be bought anywhere; but if our actions are not successful, we need to seriously examine them and re-evaluate our tactics - and develop new ones.

Our actions have been successful. Re-evaluating them is always good and I\'ve encouraged that. Wholesale dismissal of tactics is pretty stupid.

7. I don\'t deny that Seattle might have marked a break with history until that point - but a weak one. If we stop at Seattle, we will be corrupted and turn in circles.

Damn! You are sure hard to please. Who said that we stopped at Seattle?

Capitalism moves on, all the time. Seattle gave us the one-second-advantage that might have been necessary - but now it is time to put it into reality, into actions - we have, so to speak, kept the dominions busy for a time, but if we don\'t speed up now, they will pass us (again). Positively. (Sorry for all those fucking words. Lost my own thread, so I had to disguise it a bit until I again found a piece of it.)

Right, but I think you are being overly hopeless about capitalism\'s situation. The world economy is in a funk right now and globalization looks doomed because of the new US imperialism.

Cheer up! We\'re winning!

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comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 09:06 PM CDT

FYI: I\'ve been planning to add an FTAA-Miami page to Infoshop for several weeks now. Should go up pretty soon. My hope is that we can use it to mobilize people from across the Eastern U.S.

An actual physical meeting in DC would be good for us local folks.

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comment by Anti-Bloc got mad.

Authored by: Anonymous on Wednesday, May 14 2003 @ 09:57 PM CDT

Yeah; let\'s organize demonstrations, let\'s collect signatures against capitalism. Or what about our anti-voting party? And what about McAnarchy?

Tell me ONE serious way, in which you think that so-called Black Bloc tactics - vandalism on demonstrations - have any potential to bring out any part of your great vision of a new world!
How old are you people? You think you will ever see a different world than it is today? I doubt that, I doubt that.

At least you could have brought up the honesty to put some arguments at the end; to defend yourself. But a party that can\'t stand critizism is practically dead. Whether there will be a different world one day or not - now it depends on other people. Solely and positively.

So, check out www.anarchists-against-revolution.chat and don\'t forget buying Chrismas gifts!

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comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, May 15 2003 @ 08:42 PM CDT

The capitalists are concerned and worried about our movements. This is a fact. Go read their publications.

When I said that people are \"sowing doubts within our ranks,\" I\'m talking about the cops, capitalists and right wingers who post shit on activist websites putting down our accomplishments. This is what I see you doing, so I\'m waiting for you to demonstrate that you really are a concerned activist.

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comment by

Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, May 15 2003 @ 12:44 AM CDT

calgary failed because of a lack of numbers, the over-the-top police and military presense and the difficulties organisers had given the geography of the region and the bribing of potential supporters by the rcmp.

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comment by walking revolution

Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, May 15 2003 @ 09:33 AM CDT

Allen claims that protest leaders were intimidated and

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comment by mick

Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, May 16 2003 @ 01:51 PM CDT

Actually, I was referring to the nut-jobs that seem to think that the black bloc is some sort of anarchist marine corps, that we\'re at the cusp of a social revolution, and that \"we\'re winning\".

We have a long way to go to build a libertarian communist society in this world. The international working class isn\'t winning, we\'re getting the shit kicked out of us.

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comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, May 16 2003 @ 01:52 PM CDT

Protestors wearing masks were identified and observed carrying weapons and projectiles and Allen says that police sources could smell gasoline on protestors at certain points of the march.

I made the mistake in March of denying that protesters in San Francisco weren\'t carrying the stuff that police said they were carrying. A reliable source confirmed for me that the protesters were indeed carrying some interesting stuff. I hve to wonder if this fact scared the shit out of the authorities, who then proceeded to start begging the more moderate protesters to call off the shutdown of the city. I think the authorities understood how close they were in March to having an uncontrolled rebellion in San Francisco.

We can expect to see more protesters at future protests who are ready to rumble with the cops. There are more and more radicalized people out there who are tired of shit and are willing to take action outside of the constraints of activism as usual.

I think the key goal for future protests is for us to organize as big a turnout as possible and make the protests as complex as possible. The cops talk a big game about being in control, but I haven\'t been impressed by what I\'ve seen organized by the police department here in DC. The authorities haven\'t really been challenged by activists, but that should change over coming years. Complex protests (which include marches, CD, black blocs, Ya Basta, and more) are more difficult for the cops to control.

I also think we need to ask the radical lawyers to hold off on suits before the protests. They don\'t seem to understand that their lawsuits make the police intimidation tactics more public and more effective. For example, we don\'t need a lawsuit against protest pens, we just should all agree never to go into them.

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comment by lola

Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, May 17 2003 @ 08:02 PM CDT

\"I think the authorities understood how close they were in March to having an uncontrolled rebellion in San Francisco.\"

that\'s interesting.

are you implying that if somebody would have used a molotov cocktail, the protests may have turned into a rebellion?

and if that is true, is there something to be said for the possible effects of bold actions by individuals, actions which are intended to escalate the situation in the streets?

i mean, in the major protests that took place leading up to the war in iraq, would it not have been possible for bold individuals to radicalize the nature of those protests? we saw this in san francisco when breakaway marches helped set the stage for the shut-down, and literally made san fran the hotspot of antiwar protest.

what i\'m basically saying is that when it comes down to it, individuals still have to take action, it won\'t just happen because people are \'fed up\' and \'radicalized\'- people actually have to put their asses on the line...and that doesn\'t happen very often, for understandable reasons (police-state, consequences, etc).

in quebec city, i was literally SHOCKED when, on the first day, protesters marched from laval university straight to the fence, and did not even hesitate in attempting to bring it down. (i had not been involved in planning so i don\'t know how pre-meditated this was, but it sure as hell seemed like there was nothing that could stop us.)
there was no calm before the storm, no anxiety about what should be done, people just did it, even though there was an overwhelming police presence behind the fence. and truthfully, the storming of the fence on friday afternoon set the tone for the rest of the weekend. if protesters had waited for the big day of protest on saturday (for the union marches), the events in quebec city would have been very different.

keep this in mind when organizing for miami.
set the tone, and set it early.

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comment by Reverend Chuck0

Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, June 01 2003 @ 06:47 PM CDT

Viewing the black bloc as an over-glorified anarchist marine corps is pretty nutty, but to deny that we have made great progress against the capitalists recently is to deny what THEY are saying about us. Have you listened to Chomsky recently? The fact is that the capitalist class sees us as a serious threat to the point where they have taken the gloves off instead of seeing us as a curiousity. This is a good thing as far as we are concerned, but one question is whether or not we are going to band together to step things up, or waste our time on the side of the road squabbling while the revolution passes us by?

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comment by Yhcrana

Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, June 27 2003 @ 03:13 PM CDT

Chuck, this is definitely one of the best articles I\'ve ever read on Infoshop! I think that the anti-capitalist movement could really take A LOT from it. I agree completely that the recent trend of ineffective demonstrations that began in Kananasis is basically our fault and that those of who support militant direct action at have to arrive at a common understanding that some SERIOUS organization and strategic thinking will be essential if we truly want to disrupt capitalist globalization. I think that those of us who have posted comments on this article so far realize this already as do probably many other radical activists who are disenfranchised with the way mass demonstrations have been going lately. However, we can \"realize\" it and post comments about it under some relatively well-hidden article on Infoshop all we want, but what we REALLY should be doing is is making a concerted effort to bring this discussion into the forefront of the militant anti-capitalist movement. I therefore would like to present the specific suggestion that the discussion about how militant direct action at mass demonstrations can be made more effective in the wake of newly adopted police tactics be turned into a \"Featured Debate\" here on Infoshop, much like the Anarchy After Leftism thread. We could even try to get links put on other radical websites like RaiseTheFist and abolishthebank.org, as well as the features section of the International and local Indymedia websites. Hopefully, we could even get regular debate participants from protest organizing groups *like* the ACC, Mob4Glob, etc. If you would be willing to take this on as a project, I think that our movement as a whole could SORELY use it! Please let us know!

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Tuesday 28-May

Newly Developed Police Tactics to Counter Direct Action at Mass Demonstrations

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